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Praise the Lord, #TGIT is back! To prepare, we spoke with Scandal‘s Tony Goldwyn, A.K.A. President Fitzgerald Grant, about what it’s like portraying the President of the United States of America, where Fitz is at emotionally after the loss of his son, and of course, we discussed Olivia Pope.
We’re curious, do people have a hard time differentiating you as an actor because you play such an huge figure on TV as President Grant? Have fans ever called you the President?
I’m not sure if it has to do with being the President. I guess I do get a certain type of respect that I wouldn’t get if it was just me. People seem to get a real kick out of that. People tend to call me “The President” a lot.
What do you have to do to get into the mentality of such as powerful character?
Now it’s pretty natural because I’ve been doing it for a while. But in the first and second season, the thing I had to remind myself all the time, the degree of pressure the president is always under, every single second of every single day, there is so much stress, and so much weighing on every single moment. You have to have a sort of grace under that pressure. That kind of informs everything and to find grace under that pressure and a way of being cool in the face of that. The stakes were always really high and once I internalized that, it was extremely helpful.
Where would you say Fitz is at emotionally/mentally over the loss of his oldest son Jerry?
Oh god, the loss of his son Jerry almost killed him. Then there was the loss of Olivia that happened at the end of last season. But then Olivia returned and even though they’re not together, she’s back in his life in a way. But there’s hope, as he discovered. But the death of Jerry focused Fitz in a way that he’s determined. When he then lost Olivia, he was lost and utterly destroyed inside, but he was determined to be as effective a president as he can be. Now Olivia’s back and, as of the last episode in the mid-season finale, which I directed, Olivia’s been kidnapped. Fitz is being blackmailed now, that if he doesn’t go into this war in West Angola, that she will be killed and he’ll never see her again. Now Fitz has a terrible problem, because that completely undermines everything he intended to do in the wake of his son’s death to honor that memory and his job. But also the loss of Olivia is something that he can’t tolerate because he’s so desperately in love with her and so dependent on her.
How far do you think he would go to save Olivia?
I don’t know. We’ll have to see where everything goes, I can’t give any spoilers. But it’s sort of an existential crisis for Fitz. He has a responsibility to his job, the country, and everything he sees himself being about. But at the same time Olivia means more to him than anything in the world. It’s just an impossible quantity of situations.
Can you explain what it’s like to portray that relationship? What Olivia and Fitz have is nothing like anything else on TV.
You know what it is, these two people connect on a very, very deep level – emotionally, sexually, intellectually – everything. And at the same time, it’s an impossible relationship. The circumstances of their lives make it impossible. They keep making it more impossible. But it’s one of those relationships, that no matter what happens, once they’re in proximity of each other, all bets are off. They can’t deny the connection that they have. They can be enraged with each other, whatever their opinions are of what they should think; it just evaporates when they’re in each other’s presence. It’s an undeniable baseline reality of who they are to each other. It’s a very extreme kind of thing that happens.
Do you think there is something very specific about that relationship that has so many fans rooting for them, despite the fact that Fitz is married?
Well look, Fitz and Olivia it’s not just any infidelity. The truth is, yes they had an affair but you know Fitz has been in a very dysfunctional marriage and has stood up forthrightly and asked his wife for a divorce. He told Olivia he was leaving his wife. He said to Olivia 2 years ago, “I’m done, I’m choosing you.” He’s not some man who just wont leave his wife. He’s tried everything to be with the woman he loves, and Olivia, in collusion with Mellie, has blocked it. She’s forced him to wait. I know people have an issue with the infidelity but it’s not like his wife doesn’t know and he hasn’t been honest about it. And for that, I have no moral judgment about that as far as Fitz, he’s not trying to have his cake and eat it too. He’s transgressed and sinned, but so has Mellie and so has Olivia, they’re all human.
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What’s different about Olivia’s relationship with Jake versus Fitz?
I think that Jake and Olivia’s relationship is one thing, but Fitz and Olivia, I believe separate from these insane circumstances of him being the President and all the pressures that come to bear and all of Olivia’s fears about intimacy and giving herself over to someone. I think Fitz believes and I believe, in his advocacy, that if she would do what he said, they would be able to begin something substantial and powerful. They could have a family together. Hell, they’re not going to move to Vermont and he’s not going to be the mayor, that’s a fantasy but they could, as a couple, build a life together and it would be so much more powerful than they are separate. They could have a very ideal relationship, I believe. I think her relationship with Jake is something different. It’s an escape for all that. Maybe they would have a successful relationship. I do believe Olivia loves both men. But I also think that she and Fitz have a very deep connection on so many levels, professionally, and in so many ways. I think there is more heft to it.. Then there is their chemistry, while she and Jake have good chemistry, Fitz and Olivia have a chemistry that is so beyond a sexual connection, it’s that plus so much else.
Do you think that’s what fans really see? When Fitz and Olivia are in a room together, it’s very obvious their feelings and emotions for each other.
It’s super charged. They see each other and know each other in a deep, almost historic way. That was Fitz’s big point in the past, “you know me,” they connect and see the best of each other. They see the true person. I think Jake and Olivia, in a relationship, would be creating a whole new thing. They’d be leaving their life and running away and it would be a whole big thing. Maybe they can start all over and Jake can leave behind his life and start with Olivia. I think with Fitz and Olivia, they could work, if they make their way through his gauntlet. They’ve always known where they’ve been. We don’t know Jake’s past. He’s a mystery figure. He’s been a soldier his whole life. And then a B613 operative.
Switching to Fitz’s other relationship, can you tell us if you think things between Fitz and Mellie will ever recover, not the marriage but just as Fitz and Mellie, after all that’s happened, Jerry’s death on top of it all?
I think it goes back and forth with Mellie. I don’t see Mellie and Fitz recovering their romantic relationship, ever. But at the same time, as much as Fitz was disgusted and offended and to his core just cut Mellie off, when she sort of betrayed him, he still understands Mellie. He knows that’s not who Mellie really is. That’s not who the true Mellie is. That’s the desperate, damaged, wounded Mellie. He’s got the love-hate relationship with Mellie. He has real contempt for what Mellie stands for, but he has intense guilt over his neglect of Mellie. His father raped his wife and he’s got all this guilt. He’s got this complicated thing. But at the same time he respects and loves and admires Mellie for all of her best qualities and he’s also not willing to give up on that. Like so many marriages, it keeps flipping from one to the other, but they have a partnership there. They have a mutual kind of respect in some way. They both know each other’s attributes as each other’s failings.
You directed that crazy mid-season finale. Can we look forward to you directing any more episodes in this season?
No sadly, I don’t have any more for this season.
What was it like directing yourself and then your co-workers, given you’ve been working with them so much and you’re so invested in this storyline?
It’s such an experience to work from inside of it. It’s also a great privilege to be able to work with all these great actors in a different way than when I am acting with them. It’s exciting for all of us. I get to work with people I don’t usually have scenes with, like Guillermo (Huck) and Katie (Quinn), who I don’t ever act with much on screen if at all. It’s wonderful. It’s a great experience.
So, can you give us an unbiased response on whether you’re Team Jake or Team Fitz?
I endorse God fully, but I have to admit that I’m Team Fitz. I say that with full appreciation of the Jake-Olivia relationship. But I think for me, that’s a fantasy relationship, at least now, its not grounded in anything real, it’s an erotically charged escape relationship for both of those people. I think Fitz and Olivia is a relationship based on two people who could be the answer for each other, they may never find their way there, but it’s very real and the facts are established in reality.
Scandal returns to ABC Thursday, January 29th at 9 P.M.
